Oliver Stone - The Putin Interviews

OS:Really?

VP:First they have to agree on the new constitution. And this constitution has to be adopted. That is a very difficult task and a very complicated process, but should they succeed in that, then afterwards after a certain period of time, they will be able to have early elections. I think that is the best solution—a democratic way of resolving any contentious issues and also building authority.

OS:Can we go back and discuss briefly the mistakes that Assad made?

VP:I don’t think it is my place to discuss mistakes committed by heads of state and governments—my colleagues, my counterparts. But despite these mistakes that he made, the situation in Syria wouldn’t be like it is today if there had been no interference from outside. And we hear that President Assad is in conflict with his own people, this is not the whole truth. We know what ISIS says—there are so many mercenaries in it. And those are not citizens of Syria. More probably so, we might have to think about how the leadership should be built in Syria in a manner that will ensure that all ethnic and religious groups feel that they participate in this state—that they participate in the leaders. And these groups should also feel independent—free from any possible pressure, from outside. And they should also feel safe—that is very important.

OS:Well, when you’re talking about interfering parties, we’re talking about countries like Turkey? Are we’re talking about people like Saudi Arabia? We’re talking about people like Israel? And ultimately, the United States, France, Britain?

VP:Well, Israel to a lesser degree. Judging from what we see and from what we know, Israel is primarily concerned about the possibility of the spread of radical groups that might damage Israel. But when I was talking about interference from outside, I was talking about those who were sponsoring and arming, buying oil from terrorists and thereby funding them. And who does that? I think it’s very simple to determine, even not being a specialist or an intelligence officer.

OS:Are you talking about Turkey?

VP:I’m talking about those countries that I call the sponsors.

OS:And Russia’s relations with Turkey have been extreme—they’ve been up and down. I thought that Turkey was a great partner of Russia, up until this event. Then I thought you were united in trying to bring the silk road west.

VP:Yes, that used to be the case. And I think, and there were grounds to think that, that I’ve done a lot to build relations between Russia and Turkey. To us, Turkey is a great partner, important in general and also in the Black Sea. We have quite a large trade with Turkey. Certainly it has decreased right now. We view Turkey, not just as a partner, but a friendly country. More than 4 million Russian citizens used to spend their vacation in Turkey every year. [113] Background Information: See, “4.5mn Russian tourists won’t visit Turkey this year,” RT (January15, 2016). Retrieved at: https://www.rt.com/business/329075-turkey-lose-russian-tourists/

OS:Much of modern Moscow it seems was built by Turkish construction companies.

VP:Yes, certainly. In Moscow and Sochi in the run-up to the Olympic games and in other parts of the country—all across Russia. [114] Background Information: Turkish construction companies are heavily invested in Russia, having been awarded a wide variety of projects from shopping malls to facilities for the Sochi Olympics. See, “Why Turkey Aims for ‘Zero Problems’ With Russia’s War in Syria,” Behlul Ozkan, Huffington Post. Retrieved at: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/behlal-azkan/turkey-russia-syria_b_8265848.html

OS:So what happened? Did all of a sudden Erdogan decide that the Kurds were a more important issue for him than his relations with Russia? What do you think happened?

VP:Well it’s not about the Kurds. It is a problem, it is a Turkish problem but we have no relation to it whatsoever. And I simply do not have the answer myself to the question that you’ve asked. I’ve met the President of Turkey at Antalya during the G20 summit in November last year. [115] Background Information: Turkey was G20 Chair in 2015 in the resort city of Antalya on 15-16 November 2015. “G20 is the premier platform for international economic cooperation. G20 was born out of the necessity to develop joint responses against challenges brought by economic crises of 1997, and 1998. First meeting of G20 countries was held in 1999 at the level of Finance Ministers and Central Bank Governors.” http://www.mfa.gov.tr/g-20-en.en.mfa And he and I talked in great detail about our bilateral relations and also about Syria. And he set forth a number of very sensitive issues—issues that are very sensitive to him. And I told him that I was willing to help him and to cooperate with him. And when out of the blue a Russian plane was downed, at that approach of the Syrian-Turkish border, it didn’t even come up during our discussions. [116] Correction: “And when out of the blue a Russian plane was downed, at that approach of the Syrian-Turkish border it didn’t even come up during our discussions.” President Putin incorrectly recalled the timeline of events leading up to the G20 Summit since it was held in Antalya, Turkey on November 15-16, 2015, whereas the Russian plane was shot down on November 24, 2015. When we heard talk about some Turkmen and this issue wasn’t raised during our discussions either. He didn’t talk about that in Antalya at all. I was simply shocked. We demonstrated that we were willing to cooperate with Turkey on issues that were sensitive to them. So why didn’t he mention other issues that apparently are very important to him. That’s the first thing. But the most important thing consists of the following. From the very beginning, from the first days when we commenced our operation, military operation in Syria, we proposed to our Turkish partners that we should coordinate our work. And at least put in place a mechanism for such coordination. And the Turkish leadership responded, “Yes,” and they promised that in two days the defense minister and foreign minister of Turkey would come to Moscow. But they didn’t come. On many occasions we made attempts to coordinate our work on a bilateral basis, but to no avail.

OS:Let me clarify one thing. What month of last year did the Russians go in militarily to protect their base and bolster their force there?

VP:I’m afraid I might make a mistake and we have to consult the facts. But I think it was in summer. [117] Background Information: Oliver Stone asks in what month of 2015 did Russia enter Syria militarily, and Putin replies that he is uncertain of the month, but believes that it was in the summer. The fact is that Russia sent troops to Syria in early September 2015. See, “Exclusive: Russian troops join combat in Syria – sources,” Gabriela Baczynska, Tom Perry, Laila Bassam, Phil Stewart, Reuters (September 10, 2015). Retrieved at: http://www.reuters.com/article/us-mideast-crisis-syria-exclusive-idUSKCN0R91H720150910

OS:Okay, so it was before you met? You met in November?

VP:Yes, certainly.

OS:Did he talk to you about the Russian military in Syria?

VP:We heard that allegedly we were hitting the wrong targets. And we heard that that was what was preventing the solution to all issues. But the answer was very simple. Let’s work together to determine the areas which shouldn’t be hit and where there are areas which have to be hit. We could have created a coordinating mechanism, but this mechanism has never been created. And there is no coordination or information exchange going on.