President's Commission on the Assassination of - The Warren Commission (Complete Edition)

Mr. Oswald. Yes, sir, they did.

Mr. Jenner. Were you forewarned or did you have notice that the Gregorys, Paul and Peter, were to visit you on the second occasion?

Mr. Oswald. I do not recall, sir.

Mr. Jenner. Do you recall any conversation you had with your brother in advance of that visit, or with Marina on that subject?

Mr. Oswald. No, sir, I do not recall any.

Mr. Jenner. Are those the only two occasions that you ever saw or talked with Peter Gregory?

Mr. Oswald. No, sir, it was not.

Mr. Jenner. When subsequent to the second visit to your home, the first time subsequent thereto, did you see or speak with Peter Gregory?

Mr. Oswald. I spoke again with Mr. Peter Gregory on Sunday morning, November 24, 1963.

Mr. Jenner. So it was an occasion subsequent to the death of President Kennedy?

Mr. Oswald. That is correct.

Mr. Jenner. Where did that take place?

Mr. Oswald. At Howard Johnson's Restaurant on the turnpike between Fort Worth and Dallas.

Mr. Jenner. How did that come about?

Mr. Oswald. I was to meet Mr. Gregory and two Secret Service agents at that establishment, to proceed with them from there to the Executive Inn at Dallas, Tex.

Mr. Jenner. Who had arranged that rendezvous?

Mr. Oswald. By mutual consent between myself and the Secret Service agent, Mike Howard.

Mr. Jenner. Mr. Howard suggested it?

Mr. Oswald. He suggested this as a point of rendezvous on our way to Dallas.

Mr. Dulles. I believe this is described in your diary, is it not?

Mr. Oswald. Yes, sir; it is.

Mr. Jenner. Did you see or speak with Peter Gregory—have you seen or spoken with Peter Gregory at any time subsequent to this occasion?

Mr. Oswald. Yes, sir; I have.

Mr. Jenner. Now, first—when was that? Is it recorded in your diary?

Mr. Oswald. No, sir, I do not believe it is in my diary.

Mr. Jenner. And when did that meeting take place? The one you now have in mind.

Mr. Oswald. On three or four occasions during the week of November 25, 1963.

Mr. Jenner. In what city or town?

Mr. Oswald. At the Inn of the Six Flags, in Arlington, Tex.

Mr. Jenner. And was he visiting there?

Mr. Oswald. No, sir; he was there voluntarily to act as an interpreter between the United States Secret Service and Marina N. Oswald.

Mr. Jenner. I see.

Subsequent to that time, have you seen or spoken with Peter Gregory?

Mr. Oswald. No, sir; I have not.

Mr. Jenner. All right.

Now, you were seeking to report to us the friends and acquaintances of your brother and your sister-in-law subsequent to their return to the United States in June of 1962. Now, who next in addition to Paul and Peter Gregory?

Mr. Oswald. None, sir.

Mr. Jenner. None?

Mr. Oswald. None.

Mr. Jenner. Were the Fords friends of your brother Lee and your sister-in-law Marina?

Mr. Oswald. Yes, sir.

Mr. Jenner. And you became acquainted with them, when for the first time?

Mr. McKenzie. Last Tuesday, a week ago this past Tuesday, on February 11, 1964.

Mr. Jenner. You were unacquainted with either of them prior to that time?

Mr. Oswald. That is correct.

Mr. Jenner. And you have already testified about the Paines. And you can recall none other—no other persons?

Mr. Oswald. No, sir.

Mr. Jenner. Friend or acquaintance of either Marina or of your brother Lee Harvey Oswald?

Mr. Oswald. Other than the ones I have described.

Mr. Jenner. All right.

Mr. Dulles. Plus, of course, the Paines, whom you have already discussed, and others you may have discussed.

Mr. Oswald. Yes, sir.

Mr. Jenner. Did you have any knowledge of your brother Lee's defection or alleged defection other than that which you read in the newspapers?

Mr. Oswald. No, sir; I had not.

Mr. Jenner. And other—other than there might be a reference to that subject in the correspondence you have produced for us?

Mr. Oswald. That is correct.

Mr. Jenner. Do you have any possible reason to believe that your brother Lee Harvey Oswald knew Jack Ruby, or Jack Rubinstein, alias Jack Ruby?

Mr. Oswald. Sir, are you asking for my opinion?

Mr. Jenner. I am asking if you have any knowledge first—anything upon which you can base an opinion.

Mr. Oswald. No, sir, I do not.

Mr. Jenner. That he did or might have had an acquaintance with Jack Ruby, or Jack Rubinstein?

Mr. Oswald. No, sir; I do not.

Mr. Jenner. I will ask you the same question as to Officer Tippit.

Mr. Oswald. No, sir. I do not.

Mr. Dulles. With regard to Jack Ruby, you hesitated a moment.

Do you have anything else in your mind about that that you wanted to add or could add?

Mr. Oswald. I just misinterpreted his question as to whether or not he wanted my opinion, rather than any facts that I might have.

Mr. Dulles. Well, let's ask for your opinion now.

Mr. Jenner. Now, we will go to your opinion.

Do you have an opinion?

Mr. Oswald. Based on the newspaper articles that appeared during the week of November 25, 1963, at which time two reported employees of Mr. Jack Ruby, a man and a woman, stated to newspaper reporters that they had seen Lee Harvey Oswald in Mr. Ruby's establishment, known as the Carousel Club, and also on one occasion either or both of these reported witnesses stated that they had seen Mr. Ruby speaking to Lee Harvey Oswald.

Mr. Jenner. And it is on the basis of that newspaper report and only that that you voice this opinion?

Mr. Oswald. No, sir.

I might further elaborate on my opinion that at various times through various magazine articles and television programs, indicating the route taken supposedly by my brother Lee from the place of his boarding house, or apartment, and prior to his capture, was in a direct or approximately a direct line to Mr. Ruby's apartment.

Mr. Jenner. Are you acquainted with the decision which your sister-in-law, Marina, reached not to reside with your mother?

Mr. Oswald. Yes, sir; I most certainly am.

Mr. Jenner. And did you take part in that decision, or were you present during the course of any event that resulted in her ultimate decision?

Mr. Oswald. I would say that that decision, sir, was 90 percent my decision, and only 10 percent Marina N. Oswald's decision.

Mr. Jenner. All right.

Now, as to that event, would you please tell us the course it took, your participation in it, where it occurred, and as much as you now recall about it?

Mr. Oswald. This took place at the Inn——

Mr. Jenner. Before you answer—it is not recorded in your diary, is it?

Mr. McKenzie. The diary would be the best evidence of that.

Mr. Jenner. In order that I don't try to examine over 20 pages——

Mr. Dulles. I have just read the diary, and I do not recall it.

Mr. McKenzie. I don't, either. I don't believe it is.

Mr. Jenner. Proceed.

Mr. Oswald. This occurred at the Inn of the Six Flags in Arlington, Tex.

Mr. Jenner. Fix the time.

Mr. Oswald. On Thursday morning, November 28, 1963, at which time I talked to Mrs. Marina N. Oswald.

Mr. Jenner. In whose presence, if anyone?

Mr. Oswald. If memory serves me correct, sir, in the presence of Mr. Jim Martin, and perhaps one Secret Service agent that I cannot recall vividly enough to identify by name. That Mr. Martin—if I may back up, sir. We did have a Secret Service agent there. I do recall he was Mr. Gopadze, who was acting as an interpreter. And I do believe that Mr. Gopadze acted as an interpreter at the time when we discussed with Marina the possibility of her moving to Mr. Jim Martin's home in Dallas, Tex., as a permanent guest or for as long as she wished to with her children, and I believe at this time she asked my opinion of this, whether or not I thought this was the thing to do, and my advice to her was that it was, and that she was going to abide by my decision that this was the thing to do at that time.