U. Krishnamurti - The Collected Works

`A perception without the perceiver' — it's a concept, so the only thing that you can do is think about it: "What does this mean — 'a perception without the perceiver'"? Or `seeing without the seer'.... I do not use those words. I say there is no translator who is translating the sensations; they stay pure and simple sensations; there is not even the knowledge that they are sensations. Seeing, tasting, touching, smelling, hearing — these are all the sensations — these five senses are functioning. What happens when these sensations remain as sensations without the translating, you will never know. You are translating all these sensations. So, "How to stop doing it"? You are lost if you ask "How am I going to stop the translation?" You can't stop the translation; you are the product of translation. There may not be any stoppage. If somebody says there is a stoppage, "To hell with what he is saying. This chap is either a cuckoo or some far out, freaked out ape. He is talking about things that are not real to me." You don't have the courage. You don't want to accept the reality of yourself. What I am saying is something totally unrelated to the way you are functioning. Tomorrow,

you say, you want to look at things the way I say I'm looking at them. Maybe I'm deceiving myself. So, "This is the way I'm looking at it. This seems to be the only thing I know; I do not know the perceptions of that chap." So leave that chap alone — it's no use blaming that man or anybody. Nor is there any point in blaming yourself. What is the good of blaming yourself? This is the way you are functioning. So then naturally it has to stop —not stop; it has to slow down. You don't know. You come to a point where you don't know what to do about the whole business: "I can't do anything. This is the only way I know; I don't know any other way; what the other chap says makes no sense to me". So, he says "Give it a try," and you give it a try, but you don't seem to get anywhere. So, the hope keeps you going — "Tomorrow maybe I'll be able to understand what that chap says, maybe I'll succeed in doing what he wants me to do: — but you will spend the rest of your life trying to understand. But if you see the futility of it all, maybe it will stop — not really stop, but slow down.

Q: (Inaudible, but probably an attempt to compare the 'teachings' of UG and JK.)

UG:I can use various similes: the flower, for example. The nature of this human consciousness is to express itself in words — this is its fragrance. Since there are only a handful of people who, not because of what they have or haven't done, have stumbled into this kind of a thing, they talk, and when they talk there is bound to be a difference because the man's background is influencing him. You sit and compare this phrase, that phrase, this phrase, that phrase, and then you say that comparatively he says the same thing or he does not. How do you know what that chap is talking about? — this is the question I ask, you see. First of all, you do not know what he is talking about. You don't know. You see, if you knew that, you wouldn't come back year after year after year. He may say he talks for the joy of living — I don't know; you'll have to ask him. He knows that you haven't gotten anywhere, and (to be very blunt) you are not going to make it anyhow (Laughter), whatever you want. That is a blunt fact. you are not going to make it anyhow, because there is nothing to make, nothing to achieve. This is what I have been trying to communicate to those of you who come to see me and who care to listen to me: As long as you want to get or achieve something or want to be an enlightened man, you are not going to be an enlightened man. Enlightenment is to drop this whole business of wanting to be an enlightened man — that is enlightenment. I don't want to use this word.

Q: So there is enlightenment!

UG:If you want to call it that, you see. I don't know. I never say to myself "I am an enlightened man, a self-realized man." What does it mean? It doesn't mean anything to me. So to me there's no point in talking about enlightenment, or going about with my head raised, saying to myself and others "Come ye and listen to me. I am an enlightened man. I am going to liberate you all" — that's the 'holy business' — never. Maybe you are all here from curiosity. Maybe you've heard that there is some funny fellow who is saying the same thing or not the same thing, that he's brutal, he's violent and is blasting that man and saying all sorts of things. Probably curiosity brought you here, I don't know. It is all right with me if you are here from curiosity. And if you say I do all this for kicks, it is all right with me. But I'm not doing it for the kicks. What do I get? All right, assuming for a moment that I am doing all this for pleasure, why do you allow yourself to be used by me? Keep away! Don't allow yourself to be used by me! Stay away! My interest is to send you all packing. Don't allow yourself to be exploited by me! I don't get any pleasure. If you don't come tomorrow, it's all the same. But you don't believe it, because the only thing you know is pleasure. I'm not saying there is anything wrong with pleasure. Don't say that it is something wrong. If you accept that you are here for exactly the same reason that a man goes to a bordello, that's going to give you a terrible shock. There's no difference at all — the people go there every morning, day after day, (Laughs) Sunday after Sunday, at nine o'clock, rushing into the tent (in which J.K. gives his Saanen lectures) for exactly the same reasons. You may put it in any refined language that you like, you may say that I am becoming bad more and more....

"All this is gibberish talk?" — if you can see this.... I said this to myself in the tent and walked out of it. I said I would never again go to hear him or listen to anybody in this world, not only that man. So then it's finished for you — "What am I here for? What am I listening for?" Perhaps you have heard something about mutation or a transformed individual and that is what is bringing you here — that is what is haunting you; it doesn't let you go to sleep at all. So, that is the real barrier — "I do not want to be haunted by thoughts of sex; I do want to be haunted by thoughts of self-realization, God-realization, enlightenment." You may say they are a far superior thing; but they are exactly the same.

One thing I must say. This is not born out of thinking. This is not a logically ascertained premise that I am putting forth. These are just words springing up from their natural source without any thought, without any thought structure. So take it or leave it! You will be better off if you leave it.

Q: This is the same negative approach that J. Krishnamurti uses.

UG:The problem is that what you call a 'negative approach' is a positive approach; you just call it a 'negative approach', but you have turned the whole thing into a positive approach. If it is a negative approach, it has to negate itself somewhere along the line. It is very essential to use the negative approach, but you have unfortunately turned the whole negative approach into a positive approach. That man is not responsible for that; anything this structure touches, it must turn into a positive thing, because it is a product of positive thinking. So anything you listen to is turned into a method, a system — you want to get something thorough this. For example, somebody says there is a mind and you must uncondition your mind. How are you going to uncondition your mind? You are conditioning your mind through this lingo — that is all that it is necessary for you to see. Don't blame the other chap. I'll sing this song the rest of my life until I drop dead; whether anybody listens to it or not is of no importance to me. So then you leave this chap alone: you never establish any relationship with this man. The moment you use this to get whatever you want to get, or to arrive at some kind of a destination, you are tricking yourself into the same old game — this you have to see. Seeing is the end — finished, you see. But you haven't understood a thing; you go there again and again. And you have only clarified your thoughts, and through this so-called clarification you have given strength to the continuity of thought — this is all that has happened. So, it is the hope that keeps you going. You have gotten into a habit, a routine: instead of going to church, you go there — that's all you are doing. If you see the