Plato Plato - THE COMPLETE WORKS OF PLATO

ALCIBIADES: What ought I to have said?

SOCRATES: By the help of God.

ALCIBIADES: I agree; and I further say, that our relations are likely to be reversed. From this day forward, I must and will follow you as you have followed me; I will be the disciple, and you shall be my master.

SOCRATES: O that is rare! My love breeds another love: and so like the stork I shall be cherished by the bird whom I have hatched.

ALCIBIADES: Strange, but true; and henceforward I shall begin to think about justice.

SOCRATES: And I hope that you will persist; although I have fears, not because I doubt you; but I see the power of the state, which may be too much for both of us.

Table of Contents

The Greater Hippias (or What is Beauty) is one of the dialogues of Plato. It belongs to the Early Dialogues, written while the author was still young. Its precise date is uncertain, although a date of circa 390 BCE has been suggested.

Authenticity

The authorship of Hippias Major has long been in dispute. Although some works previously attributed to Plato have been ruled as not authentic, this is one where authorship has still not been firmly established, though academic consensus appears to be drifting towards favouring its authenticity. The argument is summarized in (Sider 1977): "Dorothy Tarrant is the foremost advocate for the cause of spuriousness: cf. her edition of The Hippias Major Attributed to Plato (Cambridge, 1928). Opposing her in a series of articles is G.M.A. Grube, who wrote in 1926 and 1927. W. K. C. Guthrie, in A History of Greek Philosophy (Cambridge 1975) also argues for its genuineness." Sider, writing in 1992 states that G.R.Ledger, in Re-counting Plato (Oxford 1989) carried out a computer text analysis and though not conclusive "On balance the evidence for genuineness is fairly convincing". He goes on to state that amongst other recent work, P. Woodruff, Plato: Hippias Major (Oxford 1982) also argues for authenticity and dates the document to "around 390" BCE, while C.H. Kahn, OSAP 3 (1985) is the lone modern figure maintaining spuriousness. Of online material, The Internet Encyclopaedia of Philosophy states "Of those [of Plato's works] we listed as authentic, above (in the early group), only the Hippias Major continues occasionally to be listed as inauthentic. The strongest evidence against the authenticity of the Hippias Major is the fact that it is never mentioned in any of the ancient sources. In summary then, although early 20th century scholarship argued that it was spurious, latest research indicates that on the balance it is more likely authentic than not.

Personalities

Socrates; Hippias of Elis: Hippias was a well known Sophist, originally from Elis. Known throughout Greece, he was reputed to have mastered mathematics, astronomy and rhetoric; he boasted that he could speak on any subject at Olympia without preparation. He is presented by Plato, perhaps somewhat caricaturized, as vain, narrow, and of limited intellect; much as he is in Hippias Minor.

The dialogue: define beauty

In Hippias Major, Socrates and Hippias set out to find a definition for "beauty", but are destined to fail due to their inability to formulate an answer which encompasses the entire concept. It is important to keep in mind, however, that the actual Greek term that is used in the dialogue is "kalos", which as an adjective often means fine or noble as well as beautiful. For this reason, translators like Paul Woodruff typically translate the term "the Fine" instead of "Beauty."

Introductory scene: Hippias meets Socrates

Hippias, whose business had kept him away from Athens for a long time, arrives in the city to give a lecture at Pheidostratus's school in the next few days. He meets Socrates, and the latter asks him why such a precious and wise man as Hippias has deprived the Athenians of his presence for so long. It is, explains the great Sophist, because his native Elis was so in need of his services, and entrusted him with several important diplomatic missions to different cities; notably in Sparta. He made use of his travels throughout the Greek world to educate a large number of youth and earn large sums of money. But one example was the small town of Inycus, in Sicily, where the modest inhabitants sacrificed a good part of their savings to see their children educated.

Socrates ironically assures him that this is all admirable. And if Hippias has spent such a large part of his time in Sparta, he asks, this must be where he earned the most? But Hippias demurs: he did not touch an obolus there. It was not because the Spartans did not wish the best possible education for their children, and not because they did not comprehend the true value of Hippias. The only reason was that "it is not the inherited usage of the Lacedaemonians to change their laws or to educate their children differently from what is customary. "However, Socrates emphasized, the law is precisely made for use and happiness of the citizens, two things to which Hippias would have been greatly able to contribute. By being too attached to the law and refusing the services of Hippias, the Spartans contradict the aim of their own laws and this therefore could be considered as being unlawful.

Hippias, thus suitably flattered, agrees with Socrates. The latter then asks him then how he nevertheless had so much success in this severe city of Laconia. It is not, Hippias answers, for his knowledge of arithmetic or astronomy, but rather "They are very fond of hearing about the genealogies of heroes and men, Socrates, and the foundations of cities in ancient times and, in short, about antiquity in general...[these being] beautiful pursuits,"

Socrates reveals his problem

Socrates is happy that Hippias came to reminisce on beautiful things, because this is a subject that interests Socrates greatly and with good reason. Recently, according to the latter, while criticising the beauty or ugliness of part of speeches, he claims to have been harassed by an acquaintance, who reproached him for not really knowing the definition of beauty.

Thus embarrassed by this exposure, Socrates claims to be delighted that finally one as competent as Hippias will be able to provide his opinion on the nature of beauty. The great Sophist, flattered, does not object; and is goaded on by Socrates, who offers to reprise the discussion, playing the part of the harasser. This role-play on the part of Socrates adds to the comic nature of dialogue, by allowing him to address and mock Hippias in ways which otherwise would not have been acceptable.

Hippias's three responses

First definition: beauty is a pretty girl. Hippias by his first response shows that he understood nothing of the needs of his interlocutor: "For be assured, Socrates, if I must speak the truth, a beautiful maiden is beautiful." (287e). Socrates estimates this to be, with his usual irony, a brilliant answer. But cannot they say that a lyre, a horse or even a pot is beautiful? The most beautiful of pots of course would not stand up to comparison with a beautiful girl, but then in turn what is the beauty of a girl in comparison to that of a goddess?In short, there is an infinite number of beautiful things besides beautiful girls. In any case, this is not really the question; it is not a question of knowing what is beautiful and what isn't, but rather to define beauty and to say what makes beautiful things "beautiful".

Second definition: beauty is gold. The second response offered by Hippias is not much more inspired: "This that you ask about, the beautiful, is nothing else but gold... For we all know, I fancy, that wherever this is added, even what before appears ugly will appear beautiful when adorned with gold."(289e)No doubt, replies Socrates, but what to make then of the great statue of Athena at the Parthenon? This masterpiece of Phidias is mostly made of ivory and precious stones, and not of gold. Yet the statue is magnificent. Besides, gold any other precious metal only gives rise to beauty if it is properly used. In the case of the pot, for instance, who is to say whether a wooden spoon or a golden spoon would be better to stir with, or which would be more beautiful?